Views shared by several ayurveda professionals and non-ayurveda people in discussion group:
Disclaimer:
All views shared here are only for knowledge. This information doesn’t have any scientific validation. Various doctors and non-medicos have shared their views and experiences in this discussion. Please do not try any of the suggestions described here, without prior consult from your regular, qualified doctor. Dr. Prerak Shah and no other person is responsible for any unwanted effects, side effects or contra-indications in your health. Thank you.
(Any ayurveda or medical doctor, If you like this activity, and wants to be a part of this chat discussion on whatsapp, please send in your request. Whatsapp your full name, city / country name, short intro to +91-9824243567. Thank you.)
Next topic for discussion: Agnikarma ..... It's understanding....efficacy. And usefulness in disease condition.
Dr. Bhadresh Naik: Many patients ask agnikarma mode of action Please inform anybody knows
Ayulink: I have noted many good results of Agnikarma in various disorders like neuromuscular disorders, knee Jt pain, frozen shoulder etc. Results are immediate, within seconds.... But how long it will last, that nobody knows. Even pt shows marked improvement in physical condition and pain reduction, there is no pathological changes are seen in the body - verified by X-ray or MRI.
Dr. Bhadresh Naik: We do agnikarma in Frozen shoulder, Calcanium spur, OA, Knee infusions, Planter fasciitis, Tenis elbows, Carpel tunnel syndromes, Results are encouraging but we to do repeted
Ayulink: How many times you repeat it? How long it takes on an average?
Dr. Bhadresh Naik: According to condition…Every 15 days 3 to4 times
Type :Direct and Indirect
With : Panchdhatu salaka, Gold, Silver shalaka, Insulin needle, Acupuncture needle, Patra (leaves), Seeds etc. are used
Dr. Bhadresh Naik: Sir we even today…Don't understand mode of action
According me: Thermal center, Pain center, Nerve conduction, Nerve stimulation play role….Thermodynamics effects play role
Vd. Hardik Bhatt: Agnikarm is a temporary but effective treatment . By agnikarm we can impress pt. for that ayurveda has fast acting treatment ... After that pt continue medicines . Agnikarm can not remove pathology .. But """ ek navu dard Juna dard ni dava Che "" em thatu hoi shake ..
I thought that the increased blood supply for wound healing gives more oxygen at painful part and that removes""aamdosh"" from that part .. So pain relieves .. For some days or weeks..
In rheumatoid arthritis agnikarm not gives result ..
Ayulink: Vd. Hardik@ you are serving as official Agnikarm Vaidya in govt hospital..... And having large number of patients every week. Can u share some video of it? Thnx.
Vd. Hardik Bhatt: Sciatica , frozen shoulder , tennis elbow , backache , knee pain ,, knee effusion gives very good result by agnikarm
Dr. Sheetal Sumra:
Dr. Sheetal Sumra: Tamar and silver shalaka.. I have this type of shalaka.
Bunty Gandhi: Sir..I have some experience of agnikarma..
- First of all my understanding of agnikarma is ,, the heat supplied to most painful spot causes release of vata at the spot immediately.
- Two years ago I got extreme pain in right shoulder..The pain was such that I wasnt able to finish six balls of over..And couldnr generate speed also.Couldn't sleep cause of shoulder pain.This lasted month..After temporary relief by pain relieving medicines, Dr asked me to do x-ray.I didnt did that and tried agnikarma. I'm first agnikarma, pain wasn't reduced much..After 7 days in 2nd agnikarma pain was reduced a quite lot upto 80%.
(Reason I believe is that in 1st a.karma spot wasnt the root cause of pain, which we found correctly in 2nd so finding root spot is must-most painful spot)
Dr. Suyog Kulkarni: Are different type of shalakas readily available , specially in Mumbai ?
Bunty Gandhi: And I think agnikarma results last long its not temporary..My pain has gone away..I have recommended agnikarma to some of known persons and few of them who tried it has more than satisfactory result.
Yestimadhu, Harde powder, honey, jatyadi taila can be used for local application at spot. After agnikarma its better to avoid bath for 3 days so to restrict water from spot... If proper caution is taken, there will be no burned skin at spot..
Dr. Bhadresh Naik: Agnikarm….Depends on heat of salaka…Samyakdagdha, Alpa dagdha, Ati dagdha….Type of salaka, Point are important
In some cases I used to do raktamoxan and agnikarma alternatives treatment
Results are encouraging
Marma presure treatment in joint and spine disorder are effective
Dr. Bhavesh Modh: Those disease which medicine don't cure,
The knife cures (शस्त्र कर्म)
Those which iron can't cure,
Fire (अग्नि कर्म )cure & those which fire not cure are to be rechoned wholly in incurable (असाध्य ) ----' HIPPOCRATES
Dr. Priti Vikas Agrawal: In my practise i see lots of pts having temporary effect in pain reduction .....after a week pain again start ...So wts the reason ..?
Dr. J. T. Contractor: May be their food style,
Bunty Gandhi: I guess few sittings required for long term relief..Only one sitting is not enough in many cases.
Bhuj Dr Jigar Gor: Can we say agnikarm is symptomatic treatment...?
Along with agnikarm we must continue the oral medication too. Then I guess samprapti bhang will be done and till that due to agnikarma pt will get relief too..
I seen so many pt, who takes agnikarma repeatedly and problem reoccur after stopping of it...!!!
Vd. Hardik Bhatt: Life style , food habit etc also to be considered ... I said above that oral medicines are necessary ... But agnikarm gives fast action ...
Dr. Priti Vikas Agrawal: different people have different view on use of application after it ..Some use ghee, or aloe vera gel or any cream
Dr. Bhadresh Naik:
Photo Courtesy by chaturvadi sonal
Vd. Sachin Kadlag: Agnikarma in Visuchika , explanations according to different ayurvedic aacharyas .
1. Sushruta
साध्यासु ( विसूचिकासु) पार्ष्ण्योर्दहनं प्रशस्तम्.... ।
Sushruta Uttartantra 56/12
In visuchika which is curable it is best to do agnikarma at both heels .
2. Dalhana :-
पार्ष्णिदहनम् अत्र संज्ञाप्रबोधनार्थम् अधः अतिप्रवृत्तिवारणार्थं च।
In visuchika agnikarma at heel is advised for 2 following reasons :- a) to make patient conscious (b) to stop excessive loose motions.
Vd. Sachin Kadlag: 3. Vagbhata :-
विसूच्यां अतिवृद्धायां पार्ष्ण्योर्दाहः प्रशस्यते ।
In too much aggravated visuchika agnikarma at both heels is best .
4. Hemadri :-
सर्वेषु आमदोषेषु पार्ष्ण्योर्दाहः शस्यते, विसूच्यां तु प्रकर्षेण ।
Agnikarma at both heels is good in all aamadosha , especially in visuchika.
5. Bheda :-
विसूच्यां अतिवृद्धायां पार्ष्णिदेशे च दाहयेत्। पिप्पल्या वा अपि अरण्या वा शस्त्रेणातापितेन वा।
In too much aggravated visuchika agnikarma at heel is to be done either by pippali ( piper longum) or by aarani .
6. Vangasen :-
विलम्बिकालसकयोः विसूचि उक्तः क्रियाक्रमः।
In Vilambika and alasak also treatment sequence of visuchika is to be followed., hence if those two also gets too much aggravated agnikarma should be done at both heels.
7. Sharangdhar :-
विषूच्यां पार्ष्णिदाहेन जायते अग्नेः प्रदिपनम्। संकुचन्ति यतस्तेन
रसश्लेष्मवहाः सिराः।। Sharangdhar samhita uttarkahand.
In visuchika , agnikarma at heels , does agni deepan ( increases digestive power) and it also does constriction of rasavaha and shleshmavaha sira / srotas.
Vd. Hardik Bhatt: Any referance for vruddhi or hernia .. For agnikarm which places we can do ...?
Vd. Neeraj Pooner: Except sharad and grishma ritu agni karma to be done
In all ritus and in all rogas pichila anna to be taken before agni karma except in ashmari, bhagndar, arsh, mukh rog where withour eating food agmi karma is to be done - shushruta samhita
Four type of dahan kriya - valaya(circular) , bindu(point) , bilekha (lines), paratisrana(itching with hot shlaka)
Dr. Feroz Khan:
Vd. Neeraj Pooner: Along with astang hridyakara 3 more types
Ardh chandrakar (half lunar), swastik, astapad
Vd Tushar Trivedi MD: I experienced that when we do agnikarma on specific point, after some times pain reoccurance is seen. but at that time site of pain is different and having pain less than before...
It may be due to displacement of vayu from there...so it should be have impact on samprapti.. Plz others share their experience about it...
Vd. Pankaj Chhayani: There are two theory of pain relief. 1) Central pathway 2) Gate in pathway. Acupuncture, massage, Agnikarma all are working on these two theory
Vd. Sachin Kadlag: @ Dr Trivedi , opinion one of my senior most guru ( 44 yrs experience of ayurveda practice) told me that due to agnikarma done for pain relief ( neuralgia type) , the nerve at that site got burned/damaged. But as nerve tissues can regenerate, neuronal cells develop collaterally, and again neuralgia (pain) starts, but location is changed depending upon site of collateral nerve .
Germany Helga Fuchs: It is a big difference between Agnikarma and Acupunctur. In Acupunctur you go to the Chi and this flow get stronger. You can feel this as therapist. Agnikarma I think is to burn something away. It is operation who reduce something, like operation of hämorrhoides, Tumors... Only to work with heat is not real agnikarma.
Vd. Sachin Kadlag: However, if a nerve is damaged, it does have the ability to regenerate if its soma and a small portion of the neurilemma remain. Neuroregeneration refers to the regrowth or repair of nervous tissues, cells, or cell products. Such mechanisms may include generation of new neurons, glia, axons, myelin, or synapses. Regeneration of Nerve Fibers - Boundless
https://www.boundless.com › textbooks
Colombia Enrique Jorge Galindo Bogota: This information is very important and very useful, thanx
----------------------- comments from active group ----------------------
Dr. Sreedevi N V: Seen agnikarma in sciatica patient..done using tapta panchaloha salaka.. done in poiints where maxmum pain ws flt..pt.had diffclty in walking n ws limping..aftr d procedure..done lepana wt kumari swarasa. Pt.had reduced pain n ws able to walk comfortably😀
Dr. Caroline Theresa Cutinha: Agnikarma beneficial for vatakantaka tennis elbow and katishoola..gives instant relief.
But not for prolonged time.
Vd. Jitu Hadiya: Any video of sciatica pt.??? Agnikarma.?
Dr. Anjana Prakash: Best results seen in carpel tunnel syndrome.
Ayulink: I have noted many good results of Agnikarma in various disorders like neuromuscular disorders, knee Jt pain, frozen shoulder etc. Results are immediate, within seconds.... But how long it will last, that nobody knows. Even pt shows marked improvement in physical condition and pain reduction, there is no pathological changes are seen in the body - verified by X-ray or MRI.
Dr. Shailesh Phalle: Rt sir.. There is improvement in physical condition for limited period of time... When hetu/nidan seven is going then pain ultimately aggregates.... I am doing that in vatkantak... Pain reduces atleast for 6 months..Its beneficial.... We are doing on janusandhi shool and vatkantak....
Dr. Arvind Shahane: Agnikarm works on
1) twak
2) mansa
3) Shira
4) snayu
5) ashthi
6) sandhi
I am using silver shalaka
N I am getting excellent result
Ayulink: Doctor in my hospital uses silver shalaka too
Dr. Arvind Shahane:
Colombia Dr. Sandra Milena Galvis: " A Clinical Study of Efficacy of Agnikarm: An Ancient Treatment Method in the Management of Heel Pain
268 Reads with Article (PDF Available) • March 2015
DOI: 10.14259/av.v2i1.168
1st Amar Prakash Dwivedi
2nd Shanmugamurthy Lakshmanan
18.19 • Vetha Center for Transdiciplinary Studies, NJIT
Abstract
Agnikarm is an ancient pain treatment tool that has been practiced and documented for at least 3000 yrs [1, 2]. Due to the time gap, arcane status of the modern scientists, cultural limitations and linguistic barriers, the Ayurvedic-Para Surgical Procedure (APSP) [3] needs to be explained with a fresh new look that enables better understanding of this ancient technique. When compared with its counterparts, Agnikarm stands out with its efficacy [4-7]. Pain heeling [8] can be observed in various conditions, such as fracture of heel bone or lover's heel, tendo calcaneal arthralgia, tendo achilis bursitis and planter fasciitis [9,10]. In the case of planter heel pain, the characteristic feature include pain in the ball of the heel, especially when standing or walking for a long period of time that causes tenderness on the heel felt as pain distinctly at the attachment of the planter fascia to the medial tubercle of the calcaneus in addition to slight swelling at the attachment of the fascia as externally observable symptoms"
Vd. Ekta D. Patel: agnikarma is also useful for kadar (corns in feet)…In this mansadaghdha is done & pain twakdagdha is done.
Dr Kusum Pawse: In warts removal also
Ayulink: This is a different kind of Agnikarm. It seems it's electric machine. I have seen only metal rods, which they heat on fire and then place on specific point for 1-2 seconds.
Dr Feroz Khan: हा ..But beautiful and dramatic results of Agnikarma in frozen shoulder in one setting….At camp of lakhangaon
Vd. Manish A Surati: I have developed noninvasive agni karma name "vidhha agni karma" with the help of insulin Needle
Videos are available for this process…by request to author
Dr. Mrugeshkumar Patel: Sir what is specific point ?
Vd. Manish A Surati: Most tender points and you can use susrutokt vidhha point for this procedure
Dr. Mrugeshkumar Patel: What Care should be taken during this process?
Vd. Manish A Surati: If pt is diabetic than blood glucose levels must be under 180gm/dl other wise it is very safe even no need of post procedure care
Vd. Binal Jagani: Which dhatu use in these shalaka??
Dr. Mrugeshkumar Patel: After agnikarma medicine are required? After remove the pain when second agnikarma is done? What type of contraindications seen in agnikarma?
Colombia Dr Mario Herrera, Neiva, Huila: Looks similar to acupuncture Plus muxibustion. Contrainfication most be similar: do not práctice in chronic diabetic patient. Do not apply if ulcers or infection on skin
Colombia Dr. Sandra Milena Galvis: What risks are there?
Dr Feroz Khan: जिथे pain वेदना तिथे विध्द
USA Gary Yuen: Anyone know where its talked about? In Caraka can only find caution, strong remedies like this can kill a weak patient.
Dr. Mrugeshkumar Patel: When blood sugar level above 180mg/dl what type of symptoms develop??
Colombia Dr Mario Herrera, Neiva, Huila: From that level and up: Aterosclerosis, peripheral neuropaty, glomerulonephritis, macular degeneration, Skin atrophy and ulcers
Dr. Mrugeshkumar Patel: Achararya say prangatak marma ...you would see any emergency during this process?
Dr. Supratim Bir: I ve no experience of any emergence during agnikarma…In diabetic cases the points takes a longer time to heal up
Dr. Shreyas Bhalodia: I m practicing agnikarma in OA, sciatica n many joint pains….Excellent result
Dr. Mrugeshkumar Patel: @Dr Manish you say You developed noninvasive agni karm help insulin needle how it work & how you developed it?...
Dr. Mrugeshkumar Patel: @ Dr Mario when sugar level is above 180mg/dl what symptoms develop after agnikarma?
Dr. Supratim Bir: Now let's talk over the mechanism
Dr. Shreyas Bhalodia: It's works on hypo thesis of destroying superficially pain sensesory nerve ending ….So pt feels better in pain relief
* No relief in Bone /cartilage re generation …..So it's only non invasive pain management therapy....but can't cure pathology of Joint pain,
This bitter truth must be explained to patient also
Vd. Bhavesh Sirvi: Also having good results in Planter facitis and calcaneus spur after 1 session of Agnikarma patient got 70-80% relief. I advice every on 7th -15day to repeat.
Dr. Mrugeshkumar Patel: Knowledge sharing is important....
Vd. Avni Kaneria: Scare of burn remain or not??
Dr. Shreyas Bhalodia:
Dr. Shailesh Phalle: Don't worry about burn.. It will heals naturally..... But counselling of pt before treatment is necessary...
Dr. Shreyas Bhalodia: Counselling, Written Informed consent of patient must be taken prior Agni karma….Medico legally consent is necessary *Always keep in Agikarma can gives relief in pain of degenerative joints problems, but never reverse pathology, explained this truth to patient, hence always gives proper medication*
Procedure:
* Pre Agikarma : Informed written consent, Part preparation, Drapping , Cleaning with Trifala kw or Panchvalkal kwath
* Agnikarma
* Post Agikarma : Local application of Fresh Alovera, Ghee + honey or Shatadhaut ghee
* General instructions: Avoid water contact of treated part about 24 hours and Daily dressing without bandage with ghee / Alovera / any Ropan ghira or tailA can be used
Dr. Shriniwas Gujjarwar: Pls explain Agniswed technique. Thanks.
Vd. Vishal Patel: In pune Late vd.R.B.Gogate sir use to do the practice only by agnikarma and viddhakarma....around 99% of pt coming to his clinic....he was using agnikarma and viddhakarma which had very excellent results even though in diseases like sinusitis,amashaygat vaat along with regular joint pain patients....no doubt it doesn't' break the samprapti but the symptoms or pain of the pt use to come down on very large aspect.
In painful condition he use to do viddhakarma(punture) with the help of needle and after that he was doing indirect agnikarma for which he was using gold shalaka made of 14 carret which now I m also using in my clinic.
Indirect agnikarma -put the one point of shalak on the painful condition and give heat to the other side opposite point....after sometime the heat passes to the other point which the pt can felt.....this technique is more useful when u do viddhakarma first.
He was using these technique on around 25-30 pts daily in his opd.
He is also the author of the book Agnikarma and viddhakarma....which is published in Marathi and English
Vd. Vishal Patel: Yes....many vds are doing these practice in Maharashtra…In his book also....he has given the exact points of agnikarma and viddhakarma
Dr. Shriniwas Gujjarwar:
Dr. S. P. Deshpande: A small question..May be it won't be right.. does it gets burning pain during Agni Karma
Dr. Lalit Kansal: If possible tell the various points of agnikarma in different diseases specally knee pain….Once i saw a doc practicing modifing agnikarma in nerve disorders
Dr. Neha P. Bhatt: We ve got excellent results in ankle joint pain, asthi vruddhi , frozen shoulder and in corn!
Dr. Lalit Kansal: He use accupucture needles
Dr. S. P. Deshpande: Can Agni Karma be used in Skeletal metastasis which involves severe pain.
Dr. Lalit Kansal: After puncturing the needle provide heat treatmnt on other end of needle
Dr. Shreyas Bhalodia: There's little pain /burning just after agnikarma but it is immediately relieved by application of Alovera, or ghee
Dr. Hardikchandra Kalal: Agnikarma is effecting on nerves ending , is it rt ??
Dr. Shreyas Bhalodia: Ya. It's hypothesis, need more scientific research, if any one interested for it I will join them
Dr. P. A. Deshpande: I think degenerative effect r irreversible seems to be accepted firmly No doors r kept open for something to do.. I think this needs change although non medico I say it is partially true. Apart from pain in certain cases reversal is possible..study causes of degeneration .. Find out how to correct perhaps u will get answer at least partly.. Yo claim anything may create unwanted criticism I don't want that. But I can say leave something for correction..
Dr. Yogin Patel: Agnikarma-- types- durdagdh , samyak dagdh, ati dagdh
Agnikarma is pacifying kapha …….& also aama
Dr. Yogin Patel: Ak shalaka - where it is easy available in a'bad?
Dr. Arvind Shahane: Anyone has ideas for valay, Ardhachandrakar(half moon )
Swastika , Type agnikarma Chikitsa
Dr. Shriniwas Gujjarwar:
Dr. Lalit Kansal: From where we cn gt this
Dr. Hardikchandra Kalal: I think, concept for 4 shape of agnikarma
1) where ever we apply AK that place should be make swastik , ardhachandraka , rekha or bidu shape.....not only dot of these shape...example we want to apply AK on thigh region , we can make rekha shape with agnikarma shalaka..and it is not only one dot but make long rekha on pain region.... Vise versa for swastik, ardhachandrakar or bindu shape AK
Otherwise no important of these 4 type shapes of agnikarma when we apply just dot type rekha, ardhachandrakar or swastik..
Ayulink: Pl contact Gujarat Ayurveda university, Jamanagar for Agnikarma shalaka. ….They sell a set of shalaka with four different shape tips - valay,
Ardhachandrakar(half moon ), Swastika etc…It's made of copper or panchadhatu. I think price is roughly ₹ 1500/-
Vd. Mohit Verma: Susruta has mentioned the materials used for agnikarma like pipali, ajahsakrat, godant etc (for twak gata agnidahan) madhu, sneha, guda etc (for sira, snayu sandhi, asthi gata) .
Is there any practical utility regarding these concepts other than using metal now a day for mamsagata dahan.
Plz share practical approaches of above on consideration with other materials other than shalaka.
Dr. Mrugeshkumar Patel: Psychological disorder Viddha karma is helpful?
For Tennis elbow agnikarma \ viddhakarma is helpful?
Dr. Arvind Shahane: Agnikarma is very useful in tennis elbow
Dr. Nitish Dubey: Most intrested thing is Shalaka was made from a screw driver
Dr. Yogin Patel: After Vidhdha karma Agnikama & direct agnikarma - in 2 karmas what difference & when which karma should apply?
Dr. Hardikchandra Kalal: After viddha karma bleeding is common , at that time agnikarma is helpful for stop the bleeding #same like surgeons are use the cauterization after viddh arteries or veins and direct agnikarma is simple agnikarma apply on affected body part.
Dr. Neha P. Bhatt: how to use viddha karma for pain management?
Ayulink: Let's conclude this subject. It's recess time. Now u can discuss any other Ayurveda topic.
---------------------- comments from ayulink 3 group ------------------
Compilation courtesy: Dr Kinshuk Hirpara
A file with all photos is available on Flinnt.com
Disclaimer:
All views shared here are only for knowledge. This information doesn’t have any scientific validation. Various doctors and non-medicos have shared their views and experiences in this discussion. Please do not try any of the suggestions described here, without prior consult from your regular, qualified doctor. Dr. Prerak Shah and no other person is responsible for any unwanted effects, side effects or contra-indications in your health. Thank you.
(Any ayurveda or medical doctor, If you like this activity, and wants to be a part of this chat discussion on whatsapp, please send in your request. Whatsapp your full name, city / country name, short intro to +91-9824243567. Thank you.)
Next topic for discussion: Agnikarma ..... It's understanding....efficacy. And usefulness in disease condition.
Dr. Bhadresh Naik: Many patients ask agnikarma mode of action Please inform anybody knows
Ayulink: I have noted many good results of Agnikarma in various disorders like neuromuscular disorders, knee Jt pain, frozen shoulder etc. Results are immediate, within seconds.... But how long it will last, that nobody knows. Even pt shows marked improvement in physical condition and pain reduction, there is no pathological changes are seen in the body - verified by X-ray or MRI.
Dr. Bhadresh Naik: We do agnikarma in Frozen shoulder, Calcanium spur, OA, Knee infusions, Planter fasciitis, Tenis elbows, Carpel tunnel syndromes, Results are encouraging but we to do repeted
Ayulink: How many times you repeat it? How long it takes on an average?
Dr. Bhadresh Naik: According to condition…Every 15 days 3 to4 times
Type :Direct and Indirect
With : Panchdhatu salaka, Gold, Silver shalaka, Insulin needle, Acupuncture needle, Patra (leaves), Seeds etc. are used
Dr. Bhadresh Naik: Sir we even today…Don't understand mode of action
According me: Thermal center, Pain center, Nerve conduction, Nerve stimulation play role….Thermodynamics effects play role
Vd. Hardik Bhatt: Agnikarm is a temporary but effective treatment . By agnikarm we can impress pt. for that ayurveda has fast acting treatment ... After that pt continue medicines . Agnikarm can not remove pathology .. But """ ek navu dard Juna dard ni dava Che "" em thatu hoi shake ..
I thought that the increased blood supply for wound healing gives more oxygen at painful part and that removes""aamdosh"" from that part .. So pain relieves .. For some days or weeks..
In rheumatoid arthritis agnikarm not gives result ..
Ayulink: Vd. Hardik@ you are serving as official Agnikarm Vaidya in govt hospital..... And having large number of patients every week. Can u share some video of it? Thnx.
Vd. Hardik Bhatt: Sciatica , frozen shoulder , tennis elbow , backache , knee pain ,, knee effusion gives very good result by agnikarm
Dr. Sheetal Sumra:
Dr. Sheetal Sumra: Tamar and silver shalaka.. I have this type of shalaka.
Bunty Gandhi: Sir..I have some experience of agnikarma..
- First of all my understanding of agnikarma is ,, the heat supplied to most painful spot causes release of vata at the spot immediately.
- Two years ago I got extreme pain in right shoulder..The pain was such that I wasnt able to finish six balls of over..And couldnr generate speed also.Couldn't sleep cause of shoulder pain.This lasted month..After temporary relief by pain relieving medicines, Dr asked me to do x-ray.I didnt did that and tried agnikarma. I'm first agnikarma, pain wasn't reduced much..After 7 days in 2nd agnikarma pain was reduced a quite lot upto 80%.
(Reason I believe is that in 1st a.karma spot wasnt the root cause of pain, which we found correctly in 2nd so finding root spot is must-most painful spot)
Dr. Suyog Kulkarni: Are different type of shalakas readily available , specially in Mumbai ?
Bunty Gandhi: And I think agnikarma results last long its not temporary..My pain has gone away..I have recommended agnikarma to some of known persons and few of them who tried it has more than satisfactory result.
Yestimadhu, Harde powder, honey, jatyadi taila can be used for local application at spot. After agnikarma its better to avoid bath for 3 days so to restrict water from spot... If proper caution is taken, there will be no burned skin at spot..
Dr. Bhadresh Naik: Agnikarm….Depends on heat of salaka…Samyakdagdha, Alpa dagdha, Ati dagdha….Type of salaka, Point are important
In some cases I used to do raktamoxan and agnikarma alternatives treatment
Results are encouraging
Marma presure treatment in joint and spine disorder are effective
Dr. Bhavesh Modh: Those disease which medicine don't cure,
The knife cures (शस्त्र कर्म)
Those which iron can't cure,
Fire (अग्नि कर्म )cure & those which fire not cure are to be rechoned wholly in incurable (असाध्य ) ----' HIPPOCRATES
Dr. Priti Vikas Agrawal: In my practise i see lots of pts having temporary effect in pain reduction .....after a week pain again start ...So wts the reason ..?
Dr. J. T. Contractor: May be their food style,
Bunty Gandhi: I guess few sittings required for long term relief..Only one sitting is not enough in many cases.
Bhuj Dr Jigar Gor: Can we say agnikarm is symptomatic treatment...?
Along with agnikarm we must continue the oral medication too. Then I guess samprapti bhang will be done and till that due to agnikarma pt will get relief too..
I seen so many pt, who takes agnikarma repeatedly and problem reoccur after stopping of it...!!!
Vd. Hardik Bhatt: Life style , food habit etc also to be considered ... I said above that oral medicines are necessary ... But agnikarm gives fast action ...
Dr. Priti Vikas Agrawal: different people have different view on use of application after it ..Some use ghee, or aloe vera gel or any cream
Dr. Bhadresh Naik:
Photo Courtesy by chaturvadi sonal
Vd. Sachin Kadlag: Agnikarma in Visuchika , explanations according to different ayurvedic aacharyas .
1. Sushruta
साध्यासु ( विसूचिकासु) पार्ष्ण्योर्दहनं प्रशस्तम्.... ।
Sushruta Uttartantra 56/12
In visuchika which is curable it is best to do agnikarma at both heels .
2. Dalhana :-
पार्ष्णिदहनम् अत्र संज्ञाप्रबोधनार्थम् अधः अतिप्रवृत्तिवारणार्थं च।
In visuchika agnikarma at heel is advised for 2 following reasons :- a) to make patient conscious (b) to stop excessive loose motions.
Vd. Sachin Kadlag: 3. Vagbhata :-
विसूच्यां अतिवृद्धायां पार्ष्ण्योर्दाहः प्रशस्यते ।
In too much aggravated visuchika agnikarma at both heels is best .
4. Hemadri :-
सर्वेषु आमदोषेषु पार्ष्ण्योर्दाहः शस्यते, विसूच्यां तु प्रकर्षेण ।
Agnikarma at both heels is good in all aamadosha , especially in visuchika.
5. Bheda :-
विसूच्यां अतिवृद्धायां पार्ष्णिदेशे च दाहयेत्। पिप्पल्या वा अपि अरण्या वा शस्त्रेणातापितेन वा।
In too much aggravated visuchika agnikarma at heel is to be done either by pippali ( piper longum) or by aarani .
6. Vangasen :-
विलम्बिकालसकयोः विसूचि उक्तः क्रियाक्रमः।
In Vilambika and alasak also treatment sequence of visuchika is to be followed., hence if those two also gets too much aggravated agnikarma should be done at both heels.
7. Sharangdhar :-
विषूच्यां पार्ष्णिदाहेन जायते अग्नेः प्रदिपनम्। संकुचन्ति यतस्तेन
रसश्लेष्मवहाः सिराः।। Sharangdhar samhita uttarkahand.
In visuchika , agnikarma at heels , does agni deepan ( increases digestive power) and it also does constriction of rasavaha and shleshmavaha sira / srotas.
Vd. Hardik Bhatt: Any referance for vruddhi or hernia .. For agnikarm which places we can do ...?
Vd. Neeraj Pooner: Except sharad and grishma ritu agni karma to be done
In all ritus and in all rogas pichila anna to be taken before agni karma except in ashmari, bhagndar, arsh, mukh rog where withour eating food agmi karma is to be done - shushruta samhita
Four type of dahan kriya - valaya(circular) , bindu(point) , bilekha (lines), paratisrana(itching with hot shlaka)
Dr. Feroz Khan:
Vd. Neeraj Pooner: Along with astang hridyakara 3 more types
Ardh chandrakar (half lunar), swastik, astapad
Vd Tushar Trivedi MD: I experienced that when we do agnikarma on specific point, after some times pain reoccurance is seen. but at that time site of pain is different and having pain less than before...
It may be due to displacement of vayu from there...so it should be have impact on samprapti.. Plz others share their experience about it...
Vd. Pankaj Chhayani: There are two theory of pain relief. 1) Central pathway 2) Gate in pathway. Acupuncture, massage, Agnikarma all are working on these two theory
Vd. Sachin Kadlag: @ Dr Trivedi , opinion one of my senior most guru ( 44 yrs experience of ayurveda practice) told me that due to agnikarma done for pain relief ( neuralgia type) , the nerve at that site got burned/damaged. But as nerve tissues can regenerate, neuronal cells develop collaterally, and again neuralgia (pain) starts, but location is changed depending upon site of collateral nerve .
Germany Helga Fuchs: It is a big difference between Agnikarma and Acupunctur. In Acupunctur you go to the Chi and this flow get stronger. You can feel this as therapist. Agnikarma I think is to burn something away. It is operation who reduce something, like operation of hämorrhoides, Tumors... Only to work with heat is not real agnikarma.
Vd. Sachin Kadlag: However, if a nerve is damaged, it does have the ability to regenerate if its soma and a small portion of the neurilemma remain. Neuroregeneration refers to the regrowth or repair of nervous tissues, cells, or cell products. Such mechanisms may include generation of new neurons, glia, axons, myelin, or synapses. Regeneration of Nerve Fibers - Boundless
https://www.boundless.com › textbooks
Colombia Enrique Jorge Galindo Bogota: This information is very important and very useful, thanx
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Dr. Sreedevi N V: Seen agnikarma in sciatica patient..done using tapta panchaloha salaka.. done in poiints where maxmum pain ws flt..pt.had diffclty in walking n ws limping..aftr d procedure..done lepana wt kumari swarasa. Pt.had reduced pain n ws able to walk comfortably😀
Dr. Caroline Theresa Cutinha: Agnikarma beneficial for vatakantaka tennis elbow and katishoola..gives instant relief.
But not for prolonged time.
Vd. Jitu Hadiya: Any video of sciatica pt.??? Agnikarma.?
Dr. Anjana Prakash: Best results seen in carpel tunnel syndrome.
Ayulink: I have noted many good results of Agnikarma in various disorders like neuromuscular disorders, knee Jt pain, frozen shoulder etc. Results are immediate, within seconds.... But how long it will last, that nobody knows. Even pt shows marked improvement in physical condition and pain reduction, there is no pathological changes are seen in the body - verified by X-ray or MRI.
Dr. Shailesh Phalle: Rt sir.. There is improvement in physical condition for limited period of time... When hetu/nidan seven is going then pain ultimately aggregates.... I am doing that in vatkantak... Pain reduces atleast for 6 months..Its beneficial.... We are doing on janusandhi shool and vatkantak....
Dr. Arvind Shahane: Agnikarm works on
1) twak
2) mansa
3) Shira
4) snayu
5) ashthi
6) sandhi
I am using silver shalaka
N I am getting excellent result
Ayulink: Doctor in my hospital uses silver shalaka too
Dr. Arvind Shahane:
Colombia Dr. Sandra Milena Galvis: " A Clinical Study of Efficacy of Agnikarm: An Ancient Treatment Method in the Management of Heel Pain
268 Reads with Article (PDF Available) • March 2015
DOI: 10.14259/av.v2i1.168
1st Amar Prakash Dwivedi
2nd Shanmugamurthy Lakshmanan
18.19 • Vetha Center for Transdiciplinary Studies, NJIT
Abstract
Agnikarm is an ancient pain treatment tool that has been practiced and documented for at least 3000 yrs [1, 2]. Due to the time gap, arcane status of the modern scientists, cultural limitations and linguistic barriers, the Ayurvedic-Para Surgical Procedure (APSP) [3] needs to be explained with a fresh new look that enables better understanding of this ancient technique. When compared with its counterparts, Agnikarm stands out with its efficacy [4-7]. Pain heeling [8] can be observed in various conditions, such as fracture of heel bone or lover's heel, tendo calcaneal arthralgia, tendo achilis bursitis and planter fasciitis [9,10]. In the case of planter heel pain, the characteristic feature include pain in the ball of the heel, especially when standing or walking for a long period of time that causes tenderness on the heel felt as pain distinctly at the attachment of the planter fascia to the medial tubercle of the calcaneus in addition to slight swelling at the attachment of the fascia as externally observable symptoms"
Vd. Ekta D. Patel: agnikarma is also useful for kadar (corns in feet)…In this mansadaghdha is done & pain twakdagdha is done.
Dr Kusum Pawse: In warts removal also
Ayulink: This is a different kind of Agnikarm. It seems it's electric machine. I have seen only metal rods, which they heat on fire and then place on specific point for 1-2 seconds.
Dr Feroz Khan: हा ..But beautiful and dramatic results of Agnikarma in frozen shoulder in one setting….At camp of lakhangaon
Vd. Manish A Surati: I have developed noninvasive agni karma name "vidhha agni karma" with the help of insulin Needle
Videos are available for this process…by request to author
Dr. Mrugeshkumar Patel: Sir what is specific point ?
Vd. Manish A Surati: Most tender points and you can use susrutokt vidhha point for this procedure
Dr. Mrugeshkumar Patel: What Care should be taken during this process?
Vd. Manish A Surati: If pt is diabetic than blood glucose levels must be under 180gm/dl other wise it is very safe even no need of post procedure care
Vd. Binal Jagani: Which dhatu use in these shalaka??
Dr. Mrugeshkumar Patel: After agnikarma medicine are required? After remove the pain when second agnikarma is done? What type of contraindications seen in agnikarma?
Colombia Dr Mario Herrera, Neiva, Huila: Looks similar to acupuncture Plus muxibustion. Contrainfication most be similar: do not práctice in chronic diabetic patient. Do not apply if ulcers or infection on skin
Colombia Dr. Sandra Milena Galvis: What risks are there?
Dr Feroz Khan: जिथे pain वेदना तिथे विध्द
USA Gary Yuen: Anyone know where its talked about? In Caraka can only find caution, strong remedies like this can kill a weak patient.
Dr. Mrugeshkumar Patel: When blood sugar level above 180mg/dl what type of symptoms develop??
Colombia Dr Mario Herrera, Neiva, Huila: From that level and up: Aterosclerosis, peripheral neuropaty, glomerulonephritis, macular degeneration, Skin atrophy and ulcers
Dr. Mrugeshkumar Patel: Achararya say prangatak marma ...you would see any emergency during this process?
Dr. Supratim Bir: I ve no experience of any emergence during agnikarma…In diabetic cases the points takes a longer time to heal up
Dr. Shreyas Bhalodia: I m practicing agnikarma in OA, sciatica n many joint pains….Excellent result
Dr. Mrugeshkumar Patel: @Dr Manish you say You developed noninvasive agni karm help insulin needle how it work & how you developed it?...
Dr. Mrugeshkumar Patel: @ Dr Mario when sugar level is above 180mg/dl what symptoms develop after agnikarma?
Dr. Supratim Bir: Now let's talk over the mechanism
Dr. Shreyas Bhalodia: It's works on hypo thesis of destroying superficially pain sensesory nerve ending ….So pt feels better in pain relief
* No relief in Bone /cartilage re generation …..So it's only non invasive pain management therapy....but can't cure pathology of Joint pain,
This bitter truth must be explained to patient also
Vd. Bhavesh Sirvi: Also having good results in Planter facitis and calcaneus spur after 1 session of Agnikarma patient got 70-80% relief. I advice every on 7th -15day to repeat.
Dr. Mrugeshkumar Patel: Knowledge sharing is important....
Vd. Avni Kaneria: Scare of burn remain or not??
Dr. Shreyas Bhalodia:
Dr. Shailesh Phalle: Don't worry about burn.. It will heals naturally..... But counselling of pt before treatment is necessary...
Dr. Shreyas Bhalodia: Counselling, Written Informed consent of patient must be taken prior Agni karma….Medico legally consent is necessary *Always keep in Agikarma can gives relief in pain of degenerative joints problems, but never reverse pathology, explained this truth to patient, hence always gives proper medication*
Procedure:
* Pre Agikarma : Informed written consent, Part preparation, Drapping , Cleaning with Trifala kw or Panchvalkal kwath
* Agnikarma
* Post Agikarma : Local application of Fresh Alovera, Ghee + honey or Shatadhaut ghee
* General instructions: Avoid water contact of treated part about 24 hours and Daily dressing without bandage with ghee / Alovera / any Ropan ghira or tailA can be used
Dr. Shriniwas Gujjarwar: Pls explain Agniswed technique. Thanks.
Vd. Vishal Patel: In pune Late vd.R.B.Gogate sir use to do the practice only by agnikarma and viddhakarma....around 99% of pt coming to his clinic....he was using agnikarma and viddhakarma which had very excellent results even though in diseases like sinusitis,amashaygat vaat along with regular joint pain patients....no doubt it doesn't' break the samprapti but the symptoms or pain of the pt use to come down on very large aspect.
In painful condition he use to do viddhakarma(punture) with the help of needle and after that he was doing indirect agnikarma for which he was using gold shalaka made of 14 carret which now I m also using in my clinic.
Indirect agnikarma -put the one point of shalak on the painful condition and give heat to the other side opposite point....after sometime the heat passes to the other point which the pt can felt.....this technique is more useful when u do viddhakarma first.
He was using these technique on around 25-30 pts daily in his opd.
He is also the author of the book Agnikarma and viddhakarma....which is published in Marathi and English
Vd. Vishal Patel: Yes....many vds are doing these practice in Maharashtra…In his book also....he has given the exact points of agnikarma and viddhakarma
Dr. Shriniwas Gujjarwar:
Dr. S. P. Deshpande: A small question..May be it won't be right.. does it gets burning pain during Agni Karma
Dr. Lalit Kansal: If possible tell the various points of agnikarma in different diseases specally knee pain….Once i saw a doc practicing modifing agnikarma in nerve disorders
Dr. Neha P. Bhatt: We ve got excellent results in ankle joint pain, asthi vruddhi , frozen shoulder and in corn!
Dr. Lalit Kansal: He use accupucture needles
Dr. S. P. Deshpande: Can Agni Karma be used in Skeletal metastasis which involves severe pain.
Dr. Lalit Kansal: After puncturing the needle provide heat treatmnt on other end of needle
Dr. Shreyas Bhalodia: There's little pain /burning just after agnikarma but it is immediately relieved by application of Alovera, or ghee
Dr. Hardikchandra Kalal: Agnikarma is effecting on nerves ending , is it rt ??
Dr. Shreyas Bhalodia: Ya. It's hypothesis, need more scientific research, if any one interested for it I will join them
Dr. P. A. Deshpande: I think degenerative effect r irreversible seems to be accepted firmly No doors r kept open for something to do.. I think this needs change although non medico I say it is partially true. Apart from pain in certain cases reversal is possible..study causes of degeneration .. Find out how to correct perhaps u will get answer at least partly.. Yo claim anything may create unwanted criticism I don't want that. But I can say leave something for correction..
Dr. Yogin Patel: Agnikarma-- types- durdagdh , samyak dagdh, ati dagdh
Agnikarma is pacifying kapha …….& also aama
Dr. Yogin Patel: Ak shalaka - where it is easy available in a'bad?
Dr. Arvind Shahane: Anyone has ideas for valay, Ardhachandrakar(half moon )
Swastika , Type agnikarma Chikitsa
Dr. Shriniwas Gujjarwar:
Dr. Lalit Kansal: From where we cn gt this
Dr. Hardikchandra Kalal: I think, concept for 4 shape of agnikarma
1) where ever we apply AK that place should be make swastik , ardhachandraka , rekha or bidu shape.....not only dot of these shape...example we want to apply AK on thigh region , we can make rekha shape with agnikarma shalaka..and it is not only one dot but make long rekha on pain region.... Vise versa for swastik, ardhachandrakar or bindu shape AK
Otherwise no important of these 4 type shapes of agnikarma when we apply just dot type rekha, ardhachandrakar or swastik..
Ayulink: Pl contact Gujarat Ayurveda university, Jamanagar for Agnikarma shalaka. ….They sell a set of shalaka with four different shape tips - valay,
Ardhachandrakar(half moon ), Swastika etc…It's made of copper or panchadhatu. I think price is roughly ₹ 1500/-
Vd. Mohit Verma: Susruta has mentioned the materials used for agnikarma like pipali, ajahsakrat, godant etc (for twak gata agnidahan) madhu, sneha, guda etc (for sira, snayu sandhi, asthi gata) .
Is there any practical utility regarding these concepts other than using metal now a day for mamsagata dahan.
Plz share practical approaches of above on consideration with other materials other than shalaka.
Dr. Mrugeshkumar Patel: Psychological disorder Viddha karma is helpful?
For Tennis elbow agnikarma \ viddhakarma is helpful?
Dr. Arvind Shahane: Agnikarma is very useful in tennis elbow
Dr. Nitish Dubey: Most intrested thing is Shalaka was made from a screw driver
Dr. Yogin Patel: After Vidhdha karma Agnikama & direct agnikarma - in 2 karmas what difference & when which karma should apply?
Dr. Hardikchandra Kalal: After viddha karma bleeding is common , at that time agnikarma is helpful for stop the bleeding #same like surgeons are use the cauterization after viddh arteries or veins and direct agnikarma is simple agnikarma apply on affected body part.
Dr. Neha P. Bhatt: how to use viddha karma for pain management?
Ayulink: Let's conclude this subject. It's recess time. Now u can discuss any other Ayurveda topic.
---------------------- comments from ayulink 3 group ------------------
Compilation courtesy: Dr Kinshuk Hirpara
A file with all photos is available on Flinnt.com
Dr shah
ReplyDeleteI visited u once.
I have pain in right hand and it gets numb if pressed for more time.
Can u please show me the right direction for that
Vandanaji, I personally don't practice Agnikarma. But I have an visiting doctor in my hospital, who can help you. Pl visit him on every Saturday between 4 to 7 pm. Thnx
ReplyDelete